She is always getting kidnapped, she has little to no army, and according to SuperStar Saga 100 mushroom coins is equal to 99 Beanbean coins
Quote from: Lord Ferrok on May 27, 2010, 04:21:23 PM
She is always getting kidnapped, she has little to no army, and according to SuperStar Saga 100 mushroom coins is equal to 99 Beanbean coins
what's a beanbean coin?
Quote from: tacopill on May 27, 2010, 04:43:48 PM
Quote from: Lord Ferrok on May 27, 2010, 04:21:23 PM
She is always getting kidnapped, she has little to no army, and according to SuperStar Saga 100 mushroom coins is equal to 99 Beanbean coins
what's a beanbean coin?
the money used in the Beanbean kingdom I guess
well, then we would need to know that state of the mushroom kingdom economy to use the exchange rate as evidence against or for her competence.
Anyway, i don't think we seen her actually....lead...to judge her. Not that she lacks the know-how; rather, the haven't been many opportunities to prove it one way or another.
But that's just my two cents.
Edit: her alway getting kidnapped is a part of the "rescue me" excuse plot, and they may not have the idea of an army to form one.....unless you count the toad guards. Seen in every game (not just superstar sage).
{{Fixed}}
Depression (http://www.gauravsikka.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/mariorecession.jpg)
Poverty (http://i45.tinypic.com/2hzhg2c.jpg)
Genocide
(http://wtfoodge.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/Mario-Other-Side.jpg)
...that is all.
Is Peach a competent leader.... hm... one could easily say she isn't....
In the "mainstream" series she doesn't appear to be very bright, letting herself be deceived by whatever poorly disguised plan Bowser comes up with (cake, anyone?). She is just very lucky to have Mario around who fixes almost every problem that arises. Without Mario, the whole kingdom would probably most likely collapse eventually.
However...
In the RPG series, she is usually quite capable and smart. While she still gets kidnapped rigtht and left, she actually manages to do something in these games, plays very important roles, is at points vital for Mario's success, and generally puts her damsel-counterpart from the other games to shame. In the RPG's Peach is actually one of my more favourite characters because of that.
That said the reason for Peach's reputation of being incompetent lies in Shigeru Miyamoto, since he said once in an interview that he is trying to keep Peach's personality at a minimum, thereby effectively turning her into a gullible damsel-in-distress by default to ensure Mario never loses his job.
A quote I once read about that subject springs to mind, that makes a good summary for it. "Mr. Miyamoto likes his women shallow and gullible."
So, to actually say something regarding the actual topic, I'd say "Yes, she is" in the RPGs and "No, she isn't", in most of the other games.
Remember, this is an opinion. Don't end up hurt by anything that does not conform to your views, as everything in there is subjective.
Quote from: tacopill on May 27, 2010, 04:56:30 PM
well, then we would need to know that state of the mushroom kingdom economy to use the exchange rate as evidence against or for her competence.
Anyway, i don't think we seen her actually....lead...to judge her. Not that she lacks the know-how; rather, the haven't been many opportunities to prove it one way or another.
But that's just my two cents.
Edit: her alway getting kidnapped is a part of the "rescue me" excuse plot, and they may not have the idea of an army to form one.....unless you count the toad guards. Seen in every game (not just superstar sage).
HOw about let Daisy take over the Mushroom Kingdom and put Peach into exile because she is an incompetent ruler.
Quote from: onetwentysix on May 28, 2010, 11:23:54 PM
Quote from: tacopill on May 27, 2010, 04:56:30 PM
well, then we would need to know that state of the mushroom kingdom economy to use the exchange rate as evidence against or for her competence.
Anyway, i don't think we seen her actually....lead...to judge her. Not that she lacks the know-how; rather, the haven't been many opportunities to prove it one way or another.
But that's just my two cents.
Edit: her alway getting kidnapped is a part of the "rescue me" excuse plot, and they may not have the idea of an army to form one.....unless you count the toad guards. Seen in every game (not just superstar sage).
HOw about let Daisy take over the Mushroom Kingdom and put Peach into exile because she is an incompetent ruler.
Like i said, there hasn't been enough opportunity for her prove her competence.
Also, the question of the topic is "Is Peach a competent leader?", so saying she is not competent and recommendation of her removal, would be "off-topic". And with no evidence, "Jumping the gun" can be added.
Quote from: tacopill on May 29, 2010, 01:14:31 AM
Quote from: onetwentysix on May 28, 2010, 11:23:54 PM
Quote from: tacopill on May 27, 2010, 04:56:30 PM
well, then we would need to know that state of the mushroom kingdom economy to use the exchange rate as evidence against or for her competence.
Anyway, i don't think we seen her actually....lead...to judge her. Not that she lacks the know-how; rather, the haven't been many opportunities to prove it one way or another.
But that's just my two cents.
Edit: her alway getting kidnapped is a part of the "rescue me" excuse plot, and they may not have the idea of an army to form one.....unless you count the toad guards. Seen in every game (not just superstar sage).
HOw about let Daisy take over the Mushroom Kingdom and put Peach into exile because she is an incompetent ruler.
Like i said, there hasn't been enough opportunity for her prove her competence.
Also, the question of the topic is "Is Peach a competent leader?", so saying she is not competent and recommendation of her removal, would be "off-topic". And with no evidence, "Jumping the gun" can be added.
I was just trying to get a thread here that wasn't a "Favorite"
Quote from: Lord Ferrok on May 29, 2010, 07:17:39 PM
I was just trying to get a thread here that wasn't a "Favorite"
Sorry, i didn't mean to ruin the thread.
Quote from: tacopill on May 30, 2010, 04:00:19 AM
Quote from: Lord Ferrok on May 29, 2010, 07:17:39 PM
I was just trying to get a thread here that wasn't a "Favorite"
Sorry, i didn't mean to ruin the thread.
It's alright, I just want some more activity here
yeah....i'm trying to get that as well...
While it's true we haven't seen much of Peach actually "leading" I don't expect her to be a competent one anyway, based on her character.
Quote from: Level 3 on May 30, 2010, 02:18:00 PM
While it's true we haven't seen much of Peach actually "leading" I don't expect her to be a competent one anyway, based on her character.
this, i agree with.
Input Error. Answer is dependent on a subjective adjective. Rephrase for accuracy.Competent compared to what? Bowser? Daisy? Zelda? Or the "real" world's rulers? Do you honestly expect a video game character to exactly match up to earth's standards exactly?You're both full of c***. She is almost always being captured, she has no army, and she has allowed mushrooms to evolve legs, faces, and sentience. Even when she isn't, she's constantly running off on some vacation.For that matter, do we even know if she's the ruler at all? How do we know there isn't a king?Did you ever see a king? No? So no king.
By that logic, the soup chef Shimi made on the Poshley Express can't exist either, because it was eaten before the player could see it.Now that's a completely different matter.
A king... I would love to sink a knife into his ribcage...
--------------------
And this proves that not only am I completely insane, but I am also capable of debating several different sides of an argument at once.
Quote from: mtn_otter on May 30, 2010, 11:13:50 PM
Input Error. Answer is dependent on a subjective adjective. Rephrase for accuracy.
Competent compared to what? Bowser? Daisy? Zelda? Or the "real" world's rulers? Do you honestly expect a video game character to exactly match up to earth's standards exactly?
You're both full of c***. She is almost always being captured, she has no army, and she has allowed mushrooms to evolve legs, faces, and sentience. Even when she isn't, she's constantly running off on some vacation.
For that matter, do we even know if she's the ruler at all? How do we know there isn't a king?
Did you ever see a king? No? So no king.
By that logic, the soup chef Shimi made on the Poshley Express can't exist either, because it was eaten before the player could see it.
Now that's a completely different matter.
A king... I would love to sink a knife into his ribcage...
--------------------
And this proves that not only am I completely insane, but I am also capable of debating several different sides of an argument at once.
Am i one of those two? b/c last i checked, i was full of cells, tissues, blood and organs.......and a hamster, currently taking up residence in my brain.
One of those two? There are five of us. For this mistake you must be killed.Can I do it for you? I bet his screams would be lovely as I gouge out his eyes.
*hits above with rake* You ain't never gonna be one of us.Well, there already is one of us. I am of the opinion that we are simply different reflections of...Yes, I am the alter-ego man.Than I am the ego man, gu-gu-gachoo.
How can a hamster have residence inside your brain? The human brain is inefficient enough to be made of solid matter, and thus impossible for a living macroorganism to inhabit.--------------------
If that doesn't answer you question, I doubt anything will.
Quoteyou don't pay me. we don't even exist. we're just a clever metaphor to personify the abstract concept of thought in spongebob's brain
- Source (http://www.sbmania.net/forums/lofiversion/index.php?t3078.html)
Combine that with the hamster metaphor used to symbolize thoughts in the Simpsons.
I think she is not.
TO clarify, 100 mushroom coins dont make 99 beanbean coins ;) beanbean coins are worth much less than mushroom coins. When Prince Peasley says he will give 99,999,999,999 coins to Mario and Luigi, that makes around 99 mushroom coins :) Just clarifying
keep in mind, also, exchange rates don't necessarily reflect the state of an economy. Rather, it states how the economy is doing relative to the other one.
So, the mushroom kingdom's economy may or may not be doing well, but it is doing a whole lot better that the economy of the Beanbean kingdom.
at least, that is my observation.
Quote from: Aurum on May 31, 2010, 12:20:22 AM
I think she is not.
TO clarify, 100 mushroom coins dont make 99 beanbean coins ;) beanbean coins are worth much less than mushroom coins. When Prince Peasley says he will give 99,999,999,999 coins to Mario and Luigi, that makes around 99 mushroom coins :) Just clarifying
You have it wrong, Tucayo. It is actually the other way around.
Peasley makes a bet and offers Mario and Luigi 99,999,999,999
Mushroom Coins. Due to the exchange rate, this equals 99 Beanbean Coins. Remember, you pay everything in that game with Beanbean Coins.
So Mushroom Coins are worth much less than Beanbean Coins, not the other way around. :P
At a risk of creating addicts, this actually covered in a tvtope article. do i dare post it?
Quote from: mtn_otter on May 30, 2010, 11:13:50 PM
Input Error. Answer is dependent on a subjective adjective. Rephrase for accuracy.
Competent compared to what? Bowser? Daisy? Zelda? Or the "real" world's rulers? Do you honestly expect a video game character to exactly match up to earth's standards exactly?
You're both full of c***. She is almost always being captured, she has no army, and she has allowed mushrooms to evolve legs, faces, and sentience. Even when she isn't, she's constantly running off on some vacation.
For that matter, do we even know if she's the ruler at all? How do we know there isn't a king?
Did you ever see a king? No? So no king.
By that logic, the soup chef Shimi made on the Poshley Express can't exist either, because it was eaten before the player could see it.
Now that's a completely different matter.
A king... I would love to sink a knife into his ribcage...
--------------------
And this proves that not only am I completely insane, but I am also capable of debating several different sides of an argument at once.
Peach is not a king, she is a monarch.
besides, the toads are Peach's slave. I just wish there was a revolution like the French Revolution and the Mushroom Kingdom becomes a republic. (Let bowser invade Sarasaland so Daisy is forced to come to the Mushroom Kingdom and cause a rebellion duh.)
Right now Peach is a dictator like Adolf Hitler, wanting to get rid of all the stuff under Bowser's control. Stalin.
THe Japanese should make the Beanbean kingdom a democracy or something.
Quote from: onetwentysix on June 01, 2010, 10:17:52 PM
besides, the toads are Peach's slave. I just wish there was a revolution like the French Revolution and the Mushroom Kingdom becomes a republic. (Let bowser invade Sarasaland so Daisy is forced to come to the Mushroom Kingdom and cause a rebellion duh.)
Right now Peach is a dictator like Adolf Hitler, wanting to get rid of all the stuff under Bowser's control. Stalin.
THe Japanese should make the Beanbean kingdom a democracy or something.
When did we get into politics?
The Toads aren't slaves, I don't know how that idea popped into your mind.
Quote from: Edofenrir on May 31, 2010, 02:25:47 AM
Quote from: Aurum on May 31, 2010, 12:20:22 AM
I think she is not.
TO clarify, 100 mushroom coins dont make 99 beanbean coins ;) beanbean coins are worth much less than mushroom coins. When Prince Peasley says he will give 99,999,999,999 coins to Mario and Luigi, that makes around 99 mushroom coins :) Just clarifying
You have it wrong, Tucayo. It is actually the other way around.
Peasley makes a bet and offers Mario and Luigi 99,999,999,999 Mushroom Coins. Due to the exchange rate, this equals 99 Beanbean Coins. Remember, you pay everything in that game with Beanbean Coins.
So Mushroom Coins are worth much less than Beanbean Coins, not the other way around. :P
Oh, sure, thanks :) So buying mushrooms for 30 coins in BB is not cheap
Quote from: onetwentysix on June 01, 2010, 10:13:25 PM
Peach is not a king, she is a monarch.
Kings and Queens are gender-based titles for crowned monarchs in a Feudal European-Style Monarchy (Just as Sultan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sultan) is the [I believe] Male head of a Islamic, and Nearly Sovereign, Territory).
Princesses and Princes are for Next-in-line for said crown, where as a "Crowned Prince" and "Crowded Princesses" are immediately next in line, taking precedence of non-crowned royalty.
Quote from: onetwentysix on June 01, 2010, 10:17:52 PM
besides, the toads are Peach's slave. I just wish there was a revolution like the French Revolution and the Mushroom Kingdom becomes a republic. (Let bowser invade Sarasaland so Daisy is forced to come to the Mushroom Kingdom and cause a rebellion duh.)
Right now Peach is a dictator like Adolf Hitler, wanting to get rid of all the stuff under Bowser's control. Stalin.
THe Japanese should make the Beanbean kingdom a democracy or something.
This would be difficult for the following reasons:
1) Politically: Establishing a democracy in a fictional land is a lot harder establishing a monarchy. Monarchy's have that "born-into-the-position" to fall back on, while a democracy (direct or republic) needs a constitution, elections, etc.
2) Popular Fiction: Then add on top of that, rescuing a social/political target has been in cultural-sphere since the beginning of story telling.
3) Commercially: A majority of gamers are male, and they-re are going to want to rescue a princess to fulfill the old, "rescue a damsel in distress" fantasy. (Think: Sleeping Beauty, Cinderella)
4) Historically: Revolutions (which this would require) are a bloody mess, and is outside of what's considered appropriate for target audience of Mario Games.
Also:
5) PEACH IS NOTHING LIKE STALIN OR HITLER. She has no secret police, she doesn't promote racial superiority, and i doubt she is a genus and/or Insane. There are no internment camps, no communes, no government regulated commerce, no firing squads killing people in the middle of the night to install fear - None of that!
Quote from: Gamefreak75 on June 01, 2010, 10:48:04 PM
When did we get into politics?
It's kind of hard to to get into "competent leader", without discussing Political Science & Philosophy.
Quote from: tacopill on June 02, 2010, 01:57:30 AM
Quote from: onetwentysix on June 01, 2010, 10:13:25 PM
Peach is not a king, she is a monarch.
Kings and Queens are gender-based titles for crowned monarchs in a Feudal European-Style Monarchy (Just as Sultan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sultan) is the [I believe] Male head of a Islamic, and Nearly Sovereign, Territory).
Princesses and Princes are for Next-in-line for said crown, where as a "Crowned Prince" and "Crowded Princesses" are immediately next in line, taking precedence of non-crowned royalty.
Quote from: onetwentysix on June 01, 2010, 10:17:52 PM
besides, the toads are Peach's slave. I just wish there was a revolution like the French Revolution and the Mushroom Kingdom becomes a republic. (Let bowser invade Sarasaland so Daisy is forced to come to the Mushroom Kingdom and cause a rebellion duh.)
Right now Peach is a dictator like Adolf Hitler, wanting to get rid of all the stuff under Bowser's control. Stalin.
THe Japanese should make the Beanbean kingdom a democracy or something.
This would be difficult for the following reasons:
1) Politically: Establishing a democracy in a fictional land is a lot harder establishing a monarchy. Monarchy's have that "born-into-the-position" to fall back on, while a democracy (direct or republic) needs a constitution, elections, etc.
2) Popular Fiction: Then add on top of that, rescuing a social/political target has been in cultural-sphere since the beginning of story telling.
3) Commercially: A majority of gamers are male, and they-re are going to want to rescue a princess to fulfill the old, "rescue a damsel in distress" fantasy. (Think: Sleeping Beauty, Cinderella)
4) Historically: Revolutions (which this would require) are a bloody mess, and is outside of what's considered appropriate for target audience of Mario Games.
Also:
5) PEACH IS NOTHING LIKE STALIN OR HITLER. She has no secret police, she doesn't promote racial superiority, and i doubt she is a genus and/or Insane. There are no internment camps, no communes, no government regulated commerce, no firing squads killing people in the middle of the night to install fear - None of that!
Quote from: Gamefreak75 on June 01, 2010, 10:48:04 PM
When did we get into politics?
It's kind of hard to to get into "competent leader", without discussing Political Science & Philosophy.
What do you mean by "Crowded Princesses"?
Quote from: Aurum on June 02, 2010, 01:22:29 AM
Quote from: Edofenrir on May 31, 2010, 02:25:47 AM
Quote from: Aurum on May 31, 2010, 12:20:22 AM
I think she is not.
TO clarify, 100 mushroom coins dont make 99 beanbean coins ;) beanbean coins are worth much less than mushroom coins. When Prince Peasley says he will give 99,999,999,999 coins to Mario and Luigi, that makes around 99 mushroom coins :) Just clarifying
You have it wrong, Tucayo. It is actually the other way around.
Peasley makes a bet and offers Mario and Luigi 99,999,999,999 Mushroom Coins. Due to the exchange rate, this equals 99 Beanbean Coins. Remember, you pay everything in that game with Beanbean Coins.
So Mushroom Coins are worth much less than Beanbean Coins, not the other way around. :P
Oh, sure, thanks :) So buying mushrooms for 30 coins in BB is not cheap
This is why you should save your money in Beanbean Coins (or save it in Canadian Dollars and money)
Quote from: onetwentysix on June 02, 2010, 09:27:10 PM
What do you mean by "Crowded Princesses"?
Sorry, i should of put "crowned", not "crowded".
Quote from: Maximum Pink on June 01, 2010, 11:04:03 PM
The Toads aren't slaves, I don't know how that idea popped into your mind.
Well, people at the Super Mario Wiki, notably Travix Man, say that toads are slaves.
Quote from: onetwentysix on June 21, 2010, 09:37:41 PM
Quote from: Maximum Pink on June 01, 2010, 11:04:03 PM
The Toads aren't slaves, I don't know how that idea popped into your mind.
Well, people at the Super Mario Wiki, notably Travix Man, say that toads are slaves.
still just his opinion
Quote from: Lord Ferrok on June 21, 2010, 10:01:59 PM
Quote from: onetwentysix on June 21, 2010, 09:37:41 PM
Quote from: Maximum Pink on June 01, 2010, 11:04:03 PM
The Toads aren't slaves, I don't know how that idea popped into your mind.
Well, people at the Super Mario Wiki, notably Travix Man, say that toads are slaves.
still just his opinion
this is true. We don't see any terms-of-sale.
Opinions make the world go round', but I think referring to them as "slaves" is a bit melodramatic.
One could argue that there is no in-game proof that they are slaves... but one could counter argue that there is also no in-game proof against it either. However, Mario games are made to be played by people of all ages, and so Nintendo wouldn't deliberately put adult themes and such in a game rated by the ESRB as E or K-A. In M-rated games, sure, but the Mario series never had such a game thus far.
This whole discussion is stupid, as it was brought up multiple times that none of us have seen Peach well enough as a ruler to pick a side. With this, the entire thing will just continue to go in a circle and not go anywhere. I would lock it, but I don't wish to be a heavy-handed mod with almost no clue of what to do.
They are not slaves.... Since they are the main inhabitants of Mushroom Kingdom, specially Toad Town, it is normal that they have jobs like guards, etc.
Quote from: ???? link=topic=208.msg5095#msg5095 date=1277218377
Opinions make the world go round', but I think referring to them as "slaves" is a bit melodramatic.
This whole discussion is stupid, as it was brought up multiple times that none of us have seen Peach well enough as a ruler to pick a side. With this, the entire thing will just continue to go in a circle and not go anywhere. I would lock it, but I don't wish to be a heavy-handed mod with almost no clue of what to do.
at least there is a discussion here, which is why I made it in the first place, but I guess I'll lock it for the reason you stated
This was a fun topic, its a shame you are locking it.... But as it is your topic, it is your decission
Wait:
1)When could normal members lock their own threads?
2)I left it open because I wasn't sure if it deserves to be locked.
Quote from: ???? link=topic=208.msg5107#msg5107 date=1277223670
Wait:
1)When could normal members lock their own threads?
2)I left it open because I wasn't sure if it deserves to be locked.
It's their choice when to lock them, that is why I respect Lord Ferrok's decision to do whatever he wants
The feature will have a 100% chance of being abused. But, I suppose it's fine for now since the active members are trustworthy.